The Toddler Government
By Mitch Berg
Joe Doakes from Como Park emails:
Bush put tracking devices in assault weapons and let them go to Mexico so we could track down drug cartels. Obama gave assault weapons to drug cartels to up the body count to justify gun controls in the US.
Bush tracked a few international calls to find terrorists. Obama tracked all of Verizon’s domestic calls to find terrorists.
Obama supporters are quick to remind us Bush Did It First and when Bush did it, it was illegal but now, it’s not. But there is a qualitative and quantitative difference between the two administrations’ actions. And Bush didn’t specifically run on a platform promising never to do that again.
The Democrats’ logic is: My brother stepped on an ant so I blew up a school bus full of nuns. Because he started it. And while I’m no better than he – in fact, I’m worse – he started it. So what I did was okay.
“Only a little worse than Bush,” that’s the Democrats’ new defense.
Joe Doakes
This is the sort of thing that makes a parent ground their kids.
How do we ground a government, again?
Especially one that is actively suppressing any attempt to ground it?
June 12th, 2013 at 7:08 am
Liberats have been lied to so much that they can no longer tell fantasy from reality. They are too lazy to learn the truth, so it’s much easier to parrot what their overlords tell them. The only salvation for this country is to flush out any elected official that has been in office over 8 years.
June 12th, 2013 at 8:30 am
Well we ground government by voting out the knuckleheads!
We start with Franken, Nolan, and Walz with the bonus of kicking Dayton, Swanson, and the state house out of office.
Walter Hanson
Minneapolis, MN
June 12th, 2013 at 9:28 am
I occasionally see comments get it right but for the most part discussion of these issues misses the mark. There’s a lot of hand wringing about some vague thing called privacy. That’s not it. The reason we require checks and balances, like warrants, in order for the government to look at our stuff is to prevent abuse of power.
I really don’t care if the government looks at my stuff if they are indeed looking for terrorists. I care if the police chief can harass me with constant searches of my home and car just because he didn’t like me. We all should care if the governor is able to gain access to his rival’s personal information for his own political gain.
That’s the problem with collecting large datasets like these programs do. The potential for abuse is considerable. The issue of how private companies can use our information is an important one, but it is separate to ensuring that checks and balances are in place to prevent abuse of governmental power.
June 12th, 2013 at 12:17 pm
“I really don’t care if the government looks at my stuff if they are indeed looking for terrorists. I care if the police chief (edit-IRS, too?) can harass me with constant searches of my home and car (edit-tax returns, political organization tax exempt status filings, too?) just because he didn’t like me (edit-or my political leanings, anti-abortion stance, too?). We all should care if the governor is able to gain access to his rival’s personal information for his own political gain (edit-or to share with groups the governor is aligned with, too?).
“..but it is separate to ensuring that checks and balances are in place to prevent abuse of governmental power.”
Gee, Doug / alter ego “Emery”, with an attitude like that you could become the leader of your local TEA party chapter. And what would the people at MinnPost think about that?
Back on topic- I have seen and heard a LOT of equivalence and “Bush started it” from my Lefty friends as well as on state radio. “So The Won is just like W only gooder?” is my rejoinder.
Based on the scand-a-palooza the current regime is – along with the rollover of RINO’s on immigration – expect our government to do more abuse of power with less checks and balances as more dependency of government forces more people to vote Democratic. It’s the Chicago way.
June 12th, 2013 at 12:52 pm
Seflores , I enjoyed your post regarding Ford and the St. Paul assembly plant. It was a very informative comment.
The Patriot Act was a panic reaction, and largely a mistake. I’m not sure why a member of Congress would express concern over this sort of thing. After all, it is only happening because of the sweeping powers that Congress put in the Patriot Act. If they don’t like it (and they shouldn’t), they ought to scale back the act. Until the level of fear receeds, that isn’t likely to change. And there is a large industry devoted to stoking the level of panic.
June 12th, 2013 at 12:58 pm
Emery, the trick about government databases is that they tend to “migrate” from their intended use. Every “wall” preventing this is just one corrupt official or subpoena away from falling.
Hence, we tend to limit the number of databases made. At least we used to, and hope we shall again.
June 12th, 2013 at 1:10 pm
“I really don’t care if the government looks at my stuff if they are indeed looking for terrorists.”
Why, you indeed a terrorist? If not, why should they be looking at your stuff? Anything you’d like to keep to yourself, of is it OK for them to sift through all your stuff?
Gee, I sound just like a Judge questioning a copper asking for a warrant back in those quaint old, pre-Patriot act days, don’t I?
It’s people like
EmeryDoug that empower the builders of the panopticon.June 12th, 2013 at 1:20 pm
Lavrenty Beria, one of the several heads of the Soviet Secret Police under Stalin, is widely attributed as having said: “Show me the man and I will find you the crime.” Given the Federal criminalization of virtually anything under the sun, it doesn’t seem like much of a stretch to see this sort of thing applied against the real or perceived enemies of the regime.
And it seems far more appropriate to be concerned about abuse by government as opposed to private industry. After all, Steve Balmer can’t send a bunch of guys with guns around to kick in your door.
June 12th, 2013 at 1:43 pm
I asked if Twin Cities liquor stores were going to support Republicans, not that we helped them kill the giant tax increase that would have killed many of them. I got my answer yesterday.
Falls Liqour (46th off of Hiawatha) has a big sign that says “THANK YOU GOVERNOR DAYTON”. Then goes on to say how much they love our current legisture and are happy to “work for a better Minnesota”.
Well, so nothing has changed.
June 12th, 2013 at 1:45 pm
To finish my thought….we always say to blacks, especially urban blacks, that you vote 90+ percent Democrat, yet get little in return. You are used just to get Democrats in power. That is how I feel about Minnesota liquor stores.
June 12th, 2013 at 4:22 pm
I don’t care if my data communications were intercepted in and of itself. What I care about is how the information could be used.
We have a sitting President that built his political career on smearing opponents…with the surfacing of information that the IRS targeted those of political dissent of the current adminstration is enough to completely distrust the NSA and how this infomation could be used.
So, has this information gathering prevented ANY terrorist attack?? The NSA and DHS would have you believe they have, but can’t point to a specific instance. But we can assume that it didn’t prevent the attack in Benghazi or Boston when the feds were, in fact, provided the information prior to the attacks…HANDED the information!
June 12th, 2013 at 4:31 pm
Obama could say publicly that the IRS targeting of conservative groups was illegal, and wrong, and the people behind it would be discovered and prosecuted.
But he won’t. Instead the guilty will walk into a golden retirement or be promoted.
And that is exactly the message he wants to send.
June 12th, 2013 at 4:47 pm
“Until the level of fear receeds, that isn’t likely to change.”
I think that any fear is being replaced by anger and mistrust of govt.
I think this:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
June 12th, 2013 at 4:53 pm
At least some on the left now what it feels like to have defending their core principles derided as ideological opposition to a common-sense, moderate policy.
June 12th, 2013 at 8:23 pm
Sure, if Obama doesn’t mind a month of hysterical reaction from the right, he could do that. But the fact that it would probably reduce the nation’s security exposure will be as nothing compared to a chance to scream “treason!” — however inaccurately.
On the (two dimensional) political spectrum in use in the USA, an excellent case can be made that it wraps around in a loop. That is, those on the far right are much closer in outlook to those on the far left than either is to those in the center. (Which may be why you are more likely to see someone, over a lifetime, move from far left to far right, or vice versa, than from either to moderation.)
June 13th, 2013 at 5:22 am
[…] More from Mitch’s pal Joe: Bush put tracking devices in assault weapons and let them go to Mexico so we could track down drug […]
June 13th, 2013 at 10:01 am
Emery, you’re right that the Left-Right spectrum is more a horseshoe than a straight line. Gay Marriage advocates are mad the government marriage license is restricted to one-man-one-woman. Libertarians are mad the government licenses marriages at all. Both agree the government ought to get out of regulating marriage. They have different reasons for reaching the same conclusion.
But that’s completely different from the false equivalence I decry in this post. Democrats who say “Bush started it” are acting like children, not even trying to justify their actions. “Barak Obama, Only A Little Worse Than Bush” is a fine bumper sticker. It’s not much of a defense.
June 13th, 2013 at 10:52 am
Question had been raised whether Mosques were exempt from PRISM. I am sure Emery can rationalize that exclusion as well.