Instrumentation
By Mitch Berg
Joe Doakes from Como Park writes:
Liberals (Dog Gone springs to mind) are fond of citing a 2010 study by the Minnesota County Attorneys saying voter fraud isn’t a problem. Here it is for your reading pleasure.
It wasn’t a study by the County Attorneys. It was a study by two anti-Voter-ID groups who sent a one-page survey to County Attorneys then “summarized” the results.
County Attorneys reported 1,531 investigations of felony-level illegal voting in the Coleman-Franken election. 66% of those investigations resulted in Not Chargeable decisions, so 1,010 cases were dropped. Of those dropped cases, between 50-80% were dropped because the state couldn’t prove the felon knowingly voted illegally. Apparently, felons think they can vote despite the law saying their conviction bars them, so we let them!
Of the remaining 24% of investigations that had been completed and charged (10% remained incomplete at the time of the survey), the survey said:
outcomes were nearly evenly distributed in the following categories: dismissed due to lack of evidence; heard in court; found guilty; and found to commit election fraud
So by my math, that’s 1531 cases x 90% complete = 1377 complete x 66% Not Chargeable = 909 Not Chargeable and 468 Charged -:- 4 = 117 in each category = 117 per category x 2 categories of convictions = about 234 total convictions.
Liberals like to claim that a mere 234 convictions for felony voting out of 2.9 million votes case means there is no real problem with voter fraud. Since there is no real problem, conservatives who push Voter ID must have some hidden agenda. Hey, felons are mostly Blacks, aren’t they? And if felons can’t vote, that law falls disproportionately on Blacks. Conservatives must hate Blacks! That’s it – this whole Voter ID thing is just cover for racisssss laws.
Except . . . we know for certain there were 1,531 illegal votes that should never have been counted . . . but they were. How many felons voted for the Republican instead of the Democrat? Half? Not likely. Far more likely that the disproportionately Black felon population voted like the Black non-felon population. In 2008, with Barak Obama at the top of the Democrat ticket, it’s far more likely that the vast majority of felons voted for Franken.
Counting convictions is the wrong measuring stick. Count illegal votes instead. Take 1/3 of those 1531 felon votes off Coleman’s pile (510) and 2/3 off Franken’s pile (1021) and suddenly, Franken’s 312 win becomes a 199 loss.
Felons for Franken, indeed.
Now, let’s talk about another thing that conservatives worry about but Liberals don’t. In that same election, there were 2,000 votes cast by Dead people, which is plainly impossible and should not have been counted . . . but they were. Whose pile should they come off? Which party historically depends on the “dead vote” to win elections?
Headlines are easy. Math is hard. Democrats know that which is why they incessantly confuse the issue. That’s why this report matters.
Felons for Franken. Stiffs for Stuart Smalley. Fair elections. Pick one.
That’s the big fallacy of the status’ quo’s defenders; it defends on a bit of legal circular logic. They only count convictions – but convictions are driven down by the fact that “I didn’t know” is a defense in the vast majority of ineligible voter cases. And they ignore the dead voters, and the thousands of provisional ID cards that are returned to the SOS with “nobody at the address”, and the absurdly false addresses (nine people listed a small town laundromat as “home”) – because there are no convictions. And there never can be. Because the system doesn’t find them. So there can never be any. And the wheel goes ’round.
August 15th, 2012 at 6:02 am
Just like the Amsterdam marijuana law as described in Pulp Fiction:
“It’s illegal to carry it, but that doesn’t really matter ’cause, get a load of this, all right; if you get stopped by the cops in Amsterdam, it’s illegal for them to search you. I mean, that’s a right the cops in Amsterdam don’t have.”
So, voter fraud is illegal, but the law is rarely enforced, so there are precious few convictions. Ergo, voter ID opponents can claim there is no voter fraud.
And, officially, no one in Amsterdam is carrying pot. See how it works?
August 15th, 2012 at 6:29 am
The fact that cases were dismissed because the felons didn’t know that they couldn’t vote, is very telling. How many times have we heard from law enforcement officials that ignorance of the law is no excuse and then got a ticket? The libturds and their double standards again. Prosecutors that fail to prosecute felons using that excuse are guilty of misconduct and malfeasance.
August 15th, 2012 at 6:34 am
“Joe Doakes” provides a lot of fancy numbers, but cites no source. Link please? Also, can we first see some ID with proof you actually live in “Como Park,” Joe Doakes?
If it’s felons voting you loonies are on about, how about – just spitballin’ here – purging felons from the voter roles? Cause felons can get driver’s licenses. Your proposed fix doesn’t actually address the problem you claim to be worried about.
As for the apparently rampant problem of zombie voting, Angryclown fully supports a measure requiring poll workers to ask voters on Election Day if they are actually alive. Alive voters will be the ones who answer “Yes, I am alive.” Dead voters will typically be non-responsive, wearing sunglasses and propped up on either side – no doubt by DFL operatives.
There. Angryclown fixed it for you.
August 15th, 2012 at 6:53 am
Voter “rolls.”
Once again, Angryclown is forced to sack his girl.
August 15th, 2012 at 7:56 am
I know Joe. Joe does indeed live in Como Park, next door to the hoity-toity Skipper Gardens and across the lane from a bunch of bird-brains in a multi-housing unit (you’d fit in well there, AC). Joe has Don’s old residence, vacated when beloved neighborhood icon Don died (how beloved was he? There’s a bronze statute of him out front and he was never even elected to City Council ONCE!). I’ll vouch for Joe and that means I can still vouch for 14 more people to vote this Fall. Or for Joe 14 more times, if he votes Democrat. Thank goodness for sensible election laws in this town.
August 15th, 2012 at 9:01 am
I’ll also vouch for Joe. In much the same way as I vouch for “DG” and “POD” and for that matter “DG”. They all exist.
And I can vouch for 11 more.
August 15th, 2012 at 9:06 am
Clownie spitballed how about – purging felons from the voter roles?
To which the patient answer is “Because in Minnesota you can register at the poll the day of the election.”
Glad I could clear up his misconception.
August 15th, 2012 at 9:13 am
I can be a felon and vote? Next thing you’ll tell me is you can be an illegal immigrant and vote. Or, I can be dead – and vote! What a country!
August 15th, 2012 at 9:21 am
TBS, you can’t be a felon and vote. You can be a felon and not know you’re not supposed to vote, and then vote. Then we forgive your transgression. See how that works?
August 15th, 2012 at 9:53 am
Dog Gone is a liar.
August 15th, 2012 at 10:23 am
I was not living in Minnesota in 2008, but I followed the Franken/Coleman debacle. There were two weird things about the recount: they kept finding more ballots for Franken than they did on election night and the final court decision was something like: “We know there are a pile of ballots here that must have been cast illegally, but the law provides no remedy to Coleman. Welcome to the Senate, Mr. Franken.”
I would have thought an appeal on 14th amendment grounds had a chance, but what libs like so much about the 14th is that it can mean anything. Sometimes explicit racial discrimination by the State is legal under the 14th, and sometimes any racially disparate impact is illegal under the 14th.
August 15th, 2012 at 10:27 am
Krod,
“Lie” implies intent to deceive. I don’t believe DG intends to deceive people; she just sincerely believes a lot of hogwash.
August 15th, 2012 at 10:32 am
And that defines 95% of the Democrat base.
August 15th, 2012 at 10:42 am
Kerm: You’ve stumbled onto something. “Clueless” is 95% of the democrat base. Can you see it on a bumper sticker? – “We are the 95%.” It would appear right beneath their Wellstone and Kerry stickers.
August 15th, 2012 at 11:17 am
Another way of putting this; 1500 ballots cast by felons and 2000 by dead people, and if it broke even 55-45 for the Democrats (as it certain does in Chicago when felons and dead people vote), that gives Franken the win.
I’m guessing the break was stronger than that. Yes, you can’t “prove” it with the Aussie ballot, but if you posit that one side (say the one that submitted 400,000 fraudulent voter registrations an election ago) is using this as a tiebreaker tactic, you can assume that it can be a problem and ought to be remedied before it puts Stuart Smalley into office again.
August 15th, 2012 at 12:15 pm
Pennsylvania voter ID law upheld:
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/08/15/pennsylvania-judge-upholds-voter-id-law/?ref=politics
The NY Times gives no link to the actual decision, but I have read it. The judge found that the plaintiffs did not meet the burden of proof needed for an injunction. The judge found that the witnesses presented by the plaintiff had sufficient recourse within existing law (they could vote absentee), and that a study presented by the plaintiffs did not meet the standards required to be accepted as evidence in PA (the study was the creation of a partisan lawyer using out-of-state respondents).
August 15th, 2012 at 12:44 pm
So you have Democrats denying people their Civil Rights by disenfranchising legal votes with illegally (so long as they admit that they knew what they were doing was illegal, which they will because they are ‘honest’ convicted felons – lol) placed votes. Next thing you know, Angry Clown is rolling out the fire hoses from the clown car (man, that thing holds a lot of hose). Betta shut yo mouth Wingnut, Bull Conner reigns agin’.
August 15th, 2012 at 2:52 pm
American adults favor voter by a 3 to 1 margin.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/page/2010-2019/WashingtonPost/2012/08/12/National-Politics/Polling/question_6226.xml?uuid=Nd4PSOTWEeGXOe75nF-yhQ
These aren’t bogus numbers. They have been remarkably consistent over time. We know who the extremists are, don’t we?
August 15th, 2012 at 5:53 pm
So no link or citation to a source, eh, Mr. So-Called “Joe Doakes” of “Como Park”? Thought so.
August 15th, 2012 at 6:00 pm
Link to what? You are absurd, Mr. Clown.
August 15th, 2012 at 8:13 pm
Sorry, AC, busy today. Try this:
http://www.ceimn.org/files/Facts%20about%20Ineligible%20Voting%20and%20Voter%20Fraud%20in%20Minnesota_with%20appendix.pdf
Or e-mail Mitch for a copy of the report. You’ll notice the first paragraph of my post says “Here it is for your reading pleasure.” That’s because I sent him a copy so he could verify my claim before he published it. He’s careful that way.
The study was not BY County Attorneys, but OF County Attorneys, by a pair of anti-Voter-ID advocacy groups identified on the title page.
See pages 9-12 for numbers, rates, charging decisions, etc. The survey instrument itself appears at page 35. The rest is advocacy. The math is my own, as the report is silent on total convictions, it shows only felonies.
You might also check:
http://www.electionintegritywatch.com/documents/2011-Report-Voter-Fraud-Convictions.pdf
Pages 9-11 are a list of people convicted of illegally voting, by county, name and date of birth, through last Fall. That’s useful information because Minnesota convictions are searchable online, free, here:
http://pa.courts.state.mn.us/default.aspx
I randomly verified a couple: one person paid a fine, the other sat in jail.
Real people, real convictions. Not 26 of them – nearly 200. And that’s only convictions, which is the point of the post: using convictions is the wrong tool to measure illegal voting impact on elections. 1,531 ballots were cast which we know for certain were counted and which we know for certain should not have been. In election where the margin of victory is 321 votes, that’s huge.
August 15th, 2012 at 10:21 pm
Link to whatever report he claims provides the tendentious “statistics” he cites. More likely to his most recent colonoscopy, as the numbers were more likely than not pulled from his angry white ass.
August 16th, 2012 at 12:29 am
Got link to that “white ass” reference, Angry Clown?
You comment here on occasion, dropping claims about all kinds of stuff — especially the commenters.
Perhaps “your girl” can do your research for you?
While she’s at it, have her look up the Rossi-Gregoire gubernatorial election in 2004. Over 1600 fraudulent votes cast, winning margin < 200 votes.
August 16th, 2012 at 6:49 am
As I was out of town on business, I was frightfully busy. I should have figured out how to post the report Joe emailed me.
I’ll try to do that, although it may be tomorrow at this rate.
Or, AC, you could ask for it, if it matters that much to you.
August 17th, 2012 at 1:02 pm
Mitch, maybe not a lie by your definition. But how Ms Puppymill has defined liar…
Dog Gone is a liar!