Nice blog you got here Mitch. All these years and I never read it, took a chance this weekend and now, I'll probably keep reading.

While Duke was, I repeat was a true hero, he effed up pretty bad. I'm not sure in today's fast spin and blind partisanship if the weight of this will really hit home. Aside from mail fraud, wire fraud and tax evasion, we're talking about a sitting Congressman who chairs a powerful committee admitting he took $2.4 million in bribes to steer defense contracts to conspirators during a time of war! Anyone who claims to care about the welfare of our troops should be demanding investigation to assure us that our money went for the best products and equipment for war. Kevlar vests, armor plated vehicles, food rations are all in question.
This really pisses me off. It also backs up my claim that no matter who in control of DC, oversight is needed.

When Hillary is elected, I will say the same. It keeps the politicians honest to point.

Agree..

I appreciate Cunningham's service in Vietnam.

I do not appreciate his disservice as a sitting chairman. Washington is inexorably corrupt. I'd love to say I believe Dems are less in bed with big business, but that would be a lie.

PB

Eric is dead on. Whether or not this pre-conceived war of choice brings stability to the middle east remains to be seem. One this is for certain - a small number of people are becoming extreemely rich because of it.

This is a lot bigger than one mans breaking the law and I hope to God Cunningham is talling the truth when he says he will continue to cooporate with the Governments ongoing investigation.

Preconceived war of choice? Glib, but deeply dishonest. Improved Mid-East stability remains to be seen? Cripes, it's hopeless. But just for fun, let's review:
Neighbor invading genocidal maniac out of power, murderous sons dead.
Libya unilaterally gives up WMD program that had progressed far beyond anyone's intelligence reports.
Syria withdrawing from Lebanon.
Mideast opinion slowly but inexorably turning against al Qaeda (witness top rated TV show in Mideast over Ramadan 'sweeps' month was a drama portraying terrorists in a negative light).
Corrupt UN Oil Fraud program exposed.
This is all on top of the success of Afghanistan in ousting the Taliban and ending Pakistan's nuke bazaar.
This doesn't take into account the nearly inevitable results of our efforts (IF we remain steadfast): Iran's youth dominated society seeing free Shi'ia thriving in Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Syria coming under increased pressure to cooperate in the war on terror.
An advertising copy writer once told me "If you emphasize everything you emphasize nothing. When you claim too many benefits for your product no one will believe you." One problem with the unprecedented success of the war on terror to date is that there are too many successes. People can't seem to get their minds around all of them at once. However, if the administration focuses on just one the opposition says that price we have paid does not justify that single success. The other problem is that wars -- all wars -- look messy and poorly run on a day to day basis. It is only by looking back over a 2 to 3 year period that we can see the enormity of what's been achieved. The final problem is that many people hate Bush more than they want to see us win.
Domestically we need to aggressively prosecute profiteers, while realizing that a handful of profiteers do not negate the good that is being done.

Preconceived war of choice? Glib, but deeply dishonest - prove that Chrisss, otherwise it's preety rude.

"Improved Mid-East stability remains to be seen? Cripes, it's hopeless. But just for fun, let's review:
Neighbor invading genocidal maniac out of power, murderous sons dead."

OK let's shall we:

Lots of madmen, not enough army... and we have worse than Houssien we bypassed..For starters, there is Indonesia.

Libya unilaterally gives up WMD program that had progressed far beyond anyone's intelligence reports.

Cough*Uraniumhexaflouride*Cough - Chrisss, they didn't, they simply SAID they did.. there was a report earlier this year that Bush tried to pin on No.Korea for selling U-Hex to Lybia (it's used for bombs not reactors) - except that actually No.Ko sold it to Pakistan (a legal transaction), PAKISTAN sold it to Libya..

Syria withdrawing from Lebanon

Not because of anything we did.. but ok.

Mideast opinion slowly but inexorably turning against al Qaeda (witness top rated TV show in Mideast over Ramadan 'sweeps' month was a drama portraying terrorists in a negative light).

Good--but somewhat simply opinion - regardless it assumes that the Mid-East FAVORED Al Qaeda - I'd question that assertion. Clearly the Jordanian bombings were disasterous to Al Qaeda, honestly so was 9/11, until we invaded Iraq.

Corrupt UN Oil Fraud program exposed.

We exposed a program WE had the responsibility to oversee.. I'm not sure how that refutes a pre-conceived war theory.. but ok, if it makes Normy sleep better, I'm all for it.

This is all on top of the success of Afghanistan in ousting the Taliban and ending Pakistan's nuke bazaar.

The former is not really related to Iraq, and let's review - Summer 2001 - Republicans refer to Taliban as "the kind of Muslims we can deal with." National Review (July 2001). Attacking Afghanistan was good but obvious and fully supported by pretty much everyone except whack-jobs. Again, has nothing to do with Iraq.

This doesn't take into account the nearly inevitable results of our efforts (IF we remain steadfast): Iran's youth dominated society seeing free Shi'ia thriving in Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Syria coming under increased pressure to cooperate in the war on terror.
An advertising copy writer once told me "If you emphasize everything you emphasize nothing. When you claim too many benefits for your product no one will believe you." One problem with the unprecedented success of the war on terror to date is that there are too many successes.

Well, I don't mean to be rude.. but I haven't seen many successes.. There are MORE attacks today around the world than before 9/11 (per year), there have been more people killed in the last 3 years (outside Iraq) than in the 3 years preceeding 9/11 (in terrorist attacks). Al Qaeda is presumed MUCH larger today than before 9/11. But I'll give you one thing, Syria is intimidated, as is Saudi Arabia (kinda).. because THAT was the point.. intimidate the Mid-East regarding access to Oil. That worked very well. Other than that, there don't appear to be many factual successes on Terror here Chrisss, and there are MANY factual failures.

"One problem with the unprecedented success of the war on terror to date is that there are too many successes. People can't seem to get their minds around all of them at once. However, if the administration focuses on just one the opposition says that price we have paid does not justify that single success. The other problem is that wars -- all wars -- look messy and poorly run on a day to day basis. It is only by looking back over a 2 to 3 year period that we can see the enormity of what's been achieved. The final problem is that many people hate Bush more than they want to see us win."

First, that's a strawman, second it's profoundly unfair to a lot of really well meaning people. Most have no great animosity toward Bush himself, and to simply discount dissent as hatred is a huge disservice not just to them, but to yourselves. Looking back 2.5 years now on Iraq, it is an unmitigated disaster. We have had 2 successes (a constitutional referrendum and the selection of a constitutional body), and dozens of major gaffes. The troops on the ground report how contractors basically are an unregulated militia shooting at anything and everything, we have prisons run by Shiia and Sunni militia that are excersing the kind of thing we intended to stop. We are so desperate to succeed we've turned a blind eye to much of the actions of the Shiia and started negotiating with the terrorists. Chrisss, you and I have a very different view of things in Iraq. I will offer that from a military perspective, based upon dozens of opinions of soldiers and officers, we are not winning on the ground. We may wind up with a paletable solution politically, but we'll probably have to leave entirely, to do so. As it is possible the Sunni's who want us to leave will cobble together the support to stabilize things, but that will not be because of the Administration. In some ways, it will be in spite of the administration's botched efforts, fraud filled CPA, inadequate troop levels, improper use of troops, sanctioning of "near" torture..

But one thing we can agree on..

"Domestically we need to aggressively prosecute profiteers" starting with Haliburton/KBR.

PB

Chrisss,

This is why folks don't really hate Bush...they see him as a pawn..

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-11-29-wilkerson-iraq_x.htm

It also speaks a bit to the "uncounted successes" point you've asserted. The aftermath in Iraq was pretty guessable given the exceptionally poor plan and unrestrained hubris of the planners.

PB -- a good a clearly heart felt rebuttal. My issues with the anti-Bush/anti-war crowd are twofold:
1) Questioning the motives behind the invasion of Iraq, and rewriting history in the process. Saddam was believed by everyone (from Clinton to Germany) to have WMDs, supported terrorism and hated us. He was al Qaeda's single most likely source of the weapons of mass destruction for the attack any responsible leader of the US planned to prevent.
You can question the motives behind the war, but then don't say you support the troops.
2) Saying you want the US to win, but then doing exactly what our enemies want us to do. Our enemies want Vietnam the Sequel, and the American left is giving it to them through endless attacks on the adminstration, ceaseless discussion of problems and willfully ignoring successes.
I have no problem with questioning the war. I have a problem with someone saying they want us to win and then playing directly into the hands of our enemies. It seems duplicitous to me on the most basic level. We are all part of the war effort -- individuals, media, etc. We understood that once, then forgot it. We understood what our enemies wanted us to do, and we did the opposite. We will never win a war until we learn it again.
Finally did you say we should hand over power to the Sunnis who want us out??? They will cobble together support and stabilize things? And their support will come from whom?

Chriss, If I may...

1) Questioning the motives behind the invasion of Iraq, and rewriting history in the process. Saddam was believed by everyone (from Clinton to Germany) to have WMDs, supported terrorism and hated us. He was al Qaeda's single most likely source of the weapons of mass destruction for the attack any responsible leader of the US planned to prevent.
You can question the motives behind the war, but then don't say you support the troops.

Yup. At one time, everyone believed Hussein had WMD's. That's why we put inspectors there. But they weren't finding anything were they chriss. Even while we were learning that there were no weapons, Donald Rumsfeld was telling us that we knew where they were. Remember? They were in the area north, South, East and West of Bagdhad and Tikrit.

You can choose to believe the outright lies they told or you can choose to look at the historical record leading up to the war. That's your choice but a lie, either my ommission or commission is still a lie.

And please, quit with the support the troops lecture. If you're sending Americans to fight in a war that could have been avoided, you're supporting the war and an ideology and you support using American men and women in the service as a tool.

2) Saying you want the US to win, but then doing exactly what our enemies want us to do. Our enemies want Vietnam the Sequel, and the American left is giving it to them through endless attacks on the adminstration, ceaseless discussion of problems and willfully ignoring successes.

What a complete crock of BS. Chriss, what was the Mujahedeen strategy against the Soviet occupation in Afghanistan? It wasn't to win by forcing the Soviets out. It was to bleed and bankrupt.

The fact that you claim to know what our enemies want us to do all while advocating actions that have proven disasterous for others historically just seems blazingly ignorant on your part.

Doug, I admire your willingness to place our security in the hands of UN weapons inspectors. They were duped time and time again throughout the 90's. A responsible leader of the US doesn't (or at least shouldn't) have that luxury.
You don't have to guess what our enemies are thinking, they say it all the time. We are all part of this struggle; our words and deeds, individually and collectively, don't exist in a vacuum. That's all I'm saying.
"If you're sending Americans to fight in a war that could have been avoided, you're supporting the war and an ideology and you support using American men and women in the service as a tool." Every war can be avoided, but at what cost to our freedom and security? Our servicemen and woman are indeed tools implementing US policy and achieving US goals. They KNOW that. They overwhelmingly SUPPORT the goals. So it seems to me that saying you disagree with the mission but support the troops is an insult and a disservice to our soldiers.

And PB with the USA Today link -- Stop the presses! Someone at State Dept. disagrees with Bush! I'm shocked, SHOCKED!

Doug,
The 'outright lies" you refer to were the prevailing opinion on both sides of the aisle. To deny this is sophistry. To think that Iraq is a unique or singular theatre in the War on Terror is a mistake. We are fighting radical Islam, and it has many manifestations. Eliminating the Baath regime in Iraq cuts off one source of funding. There are more, and they will be addressed.
You can make all of the partisan complaints and spout all of the talking points you want. It does not change reality.
"Cowards cut and run".

I'm dying to figure out how a piece on Duke Cunningham turned into a whizzing match about the Democrats disingenuity on Iraq...

Eric is dead on. Whether or not this pre-conceived war of choice brings stability to the middle east remains to be seem.
Posted by Doug at November 28, 2005 10:03 PM

So, Cunningham is a Republican. Republican = Bad. He took bribes from defence contractors. Defence contractors = war. War + Bad = Bush lied.
It's perfect liberal logic, Mitch.

My bad Mitch. It was the 'preconceived war of choice' and comments that sent me off topic. I'm so sick of the "wrong mission but support the troops" and "we have to win but meanwhile can engage in exactly the kind of infighting our enemies are hoping for" memes that it sets me off at the slightest provocation.
Kermit, as always, says it better than me in fewer words.
Joe Lieberman says it all even better, http://www.opinionjournal.com/forms/login.html?url=%2Feditorial%2Ffeature.html%3Fid%3D110007611&msg=&uname=
God how I wish he had won the nomination.
I also wish the sky was purple.

You know, one thing I always wonder about that seems to escape both sides of the "Saddam had WMDs/Saddam DIDN'T have WMDs" argument.

You all have seen the pictures of the MiG fighters the army found buried in the sand, no? The picture of the gas tank truck filled with gold bars?

Why do we all assume that he hasn't done the same thing with hiding his WMD's and WMD making facilities?

"I'm dying to figure out how a piece on Duke Cunningham turned into a whizzing match about the Democrats disingenuity on Iraq..."

Are you kidding? In today's politically-charged world of Internet jockies, you could post a recipe for pumpkin pie and the commentary would somehowe devolve into something about Iraq.

Pumkin pie is similar to yellow cake, ergo Bush lied.

It's a dark thing that Cunningham was being bribed, it's a good thing that he was exposed.

"Doug, I admire your willingness to place our security in the hands of UN weapons inspectors. They were duped time and time again throughout the 90's."

Duped? Hell, they were chased out at gun point periodically. I can't believe anybody, ANYBODY, uses the weapons inspectors' results as proof of anything, ANYTHING. Outside of the illogical arguement that if something isn't found it doesn't exist.

So then Powell was lying when he said in 2001,

"He has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors."

Not only is Powell a filthy liar then, so is Rice,

"But in terms of Saddam Hussein being there, let's remember that his country is divided, in effect. He does not control the northern part of his country. We are able to keep arms from him. His military forces have not been rebuilt."

Come on Matt... Clearly, Powell and Rice had the same intelligence that the Democrats had so why were they out there lying about Hussein NOT having WMD's?

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