Floyd R. Turbo advised: "This is America. Don't ever forget it."

Yeah, Mitch, I bet that's pretty easy to do, what with indignant rednecks bringing it up every ten minutes. Plus if you're that confused, they can always look at one of the the signs on the Interstate.

Can we still drink in bars covered with nothing but Irish flags and sing songs in praise of Irish terrorists?

I'm all for legal immigration. But when folks from other countries come in and can't even respect our own laws, and on top of that do things to desecrate our flag on our own soil, then I'd say crawl back into the hellhole you came from.

Lousy ingrates.

"Can we still drink in bars covered with nothing but Irish flags and sing songs in praise of Irish terrorists?"

Not really my cup of guinness; my anscestors looted and pillaged the Irish with great abandon.

But there's a difference, here. You're a DFLer, so I'll ask if even you can figure it out. Give it a shot.

think

think some more

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OK, that's plenty of time. While the Irish in their little orangist bar lose mad props for bringing their squalid anscestral squabble to the US (boooo), they
a) entered the US legally
b) aren't agitating for their own nation on US soil.

Seems fairly clear.

Will someone please give me an example of a nation where the guest workers have either a) assimilated or b) gone home when the work ran out.
And why in the world would liberals or conservatives support the introduction of an immigrant group legally defined as 2nd class citizens?

The Irish are legal? News to me - and the Bronx.

And I guess in Minnesota you don't remember guys collecting for IRA terrorists in Irish bars.

But at least they're white, eh?

Did the Irish immigrate illegally? Spill the details!

And yep, Noraid was plenty active in Minnesota; this is Saint Paul, boyo, the most Irish-doused city between Chicago and the coast. But the point (should that concern you) was that while they are fanning their squalid anscestral battle over their own country, they are not technically trying to detach, say, Brooklyn from the US and cede it to Ireland.

You HAVE heard of Aztlan, no?

AC: "The Irish are legal? News to me - and the Bronx."

You and the Bronx aren't all that well informed: neither US nor iternational law have outlawed that island nation. Are you sure you're a lawyer?

The number of illegal Irish immigrants in the US is approximately 50K. The number of illegal Mexican immigrants exceeds 5000K. Where's the proposal we treat them differently? Crying racism is the last refuge of the Democratic scoundrel when you can't make any reasoned argument.

Our essentially uncontrolled borders have allowed a very large number of poorly skilled immigrants into this country to assist businesses and keep NYC folks in cheap nannies and housekeepers. Meanwhile, real wages for the bottom quartile of Americans have declined due to wage stagnation. Even liberals such as the clown may have some passing knowledge of the principle of supply and demand: what should you expect when you allow a large influx of unskilled illegal workers in to compete with native workers? What will happen to wages for the poorly skilled native workers? You know, the "working poor" that the liberals are supposed to revere and champion?

We can make arguments about how many and of what skill set of immigrants to allow, but uncontrolled immigration isn't necessarily the best policy either socially or economically.

Of course, if we play the false race card, we should ask the clown to point out the large groups of illegal Irish immigrants that explicitely and approvingly link to separatist, racist, and violent revolutionary documents as part of their founding charters. See the MEChA debate, as an example. Nobody denies the nature of their founding documents, although some would like to say they have "moved on" since then even though those documents are still referenced by the majority of the MEChA chapters.

Angry,

You sure have a race obsession. What is it with you leftoids and race, anyhow? It's nauseating. Who cares what color the people are? Are you somehow incapable of comprehending that to most people in this country what color a man or woman is is of little or no interest? This is the least racist country on earth and you morons act like we're living in the days of the Civil War.

Haha, this is the sound of the Republican party losing California for another generation. And putting Arizona and Florida in play. All it takes is a picture of some hotheads disrespecting a flag for you to show your true colors.

You were "so close," eh Mitch? I don't really think so.

I'm thinking of getting these La Raza guys together with the organizers of San Francisco's Gay Pride. If this photo included a couple of leather S&M guys from that parade, I believe your heads would actually explode.

Hey eightgun, what's your zip code? I'd love to know the percentage of non-whites in your neighborhood. My guess is the census will tell me about .5 percent. Or you're saving up to move.

Oops, just forgot what country I'm in again - can one of you wingnuts help me out with that?

Mitch says:

People who celebrate their Irish heritage are OK because they

"aren't agitating for their own nation on US soil."

You are right. The only two groups I am aware of that are currently doing so are:

a. right wing christians

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-02-21-christian-movement_x.htm

or

b. right wing southerners

http://www.dixienet.org/

(you know the guys who already tried it once.)

People waving Mexican flags are no different from people who wave an Irish flag. There is no serious effort on the part of either to create "their own nation" in the United States.

"Haha, this is the sound of the Republican party losing California for another generation. And putting Arizona and Florida in play. All it takes is a picture of some hotheads disrespecting a flag for you to show your true colors.

"You were "so close," eh Mitch? I don't really think so."

I'm flipping back through every thread, ever, and can't find an instance of asking for your opinion on the subject.

But what would I know? I'm in Saint Paul; my block is somewhere north of 30% minority; none of them has been shot 41 times or sodomized with a broomstick or mauled by a bunch of goombahs lately.

FYI, the "true colors" comment wasn't directed at you, Mitch, but at organized wingnuttery in general. With that amendment, I stand by the point: while the right wing may make noises from time to time about supporting immigration, all it takes is a picture of a couple protesters who don't seem to know their place and it's all "Don't forget, this is Amurka, dammit!"

Again angry clown demonstrates his need for a hug.

Don't go all Ennis-and-Jack on me, billhedrick.

"maybe he was held too much as a child, maybe not held enough"

"FYI, the "true colors" comment wasn't directed at you, Mitch, but at organized wingnuttery in general."

Since I'm fairly certain Angrybigot groups me into the "wingnut" category I feel the need to declare that my brother-in-law's parents immigrated (legally) from China. My grandparents immigrated (legally) from Norway. We get along just fine, and I don't think of him as Chinese. I think of him as Bob. He's from Chicago. My niece is beautiful and my nephew rocks. Literally.
Attempts to make this a race issue are pathetic.

Some of your best friends are immigrants, eh Kerm?

Actually, no, I hadn't given any thought to you.

Friends and family. That's the point. They are now (or were, RIP) Americans. They may have strung up Norwegian flags and ate Yulekaga at Christmas but they thought of themselves as Americans. And they came here legally.
Those aren't just "a couple protesters who don't seem to know their place". They are people in open opposition to America and it's laws. Millions of them. You remember law, what you purport to practice? Silly me, I thought it was supposed to mean something.

By the way, Clown - as re the electoral stuff? I've seen some research that shows that hispanics that've been in the US more than a generation or two are at least as likely to oppose illegal immigration as most other Americans.

Granted, if the Dems succeed in their drive to allow illegal immigrants the right to vote, it'll be a moot point, but I'm just saying.

Ah, I see the Clown is trying to suggest that he cares more for brown folks than anyone else here.

Changing the subject again, son? (Either that or the final stages of syph are really kicking in.)

Quick show of hands: who's considering eating Chinese on Cinco de Mayo?

Time to build the wall and get the barbed and armed guards out.

Time to round them up and put them on boxcars...

I want them out of my country.....

Fookin' speolas....

Kermit revealed: "my brother-in-law's parents immigrated (legally) from China."

Brian Jones asked: "Quick show of hands: who's considering eating Chinese on Cinco de Mayo?"

Kermit's sister?

Actually, AC, my neighborhood is pretty ethnically diverse, but you seem to be missing the point: I don't really care how diverse OR monochrome it may be. That's simply of no interest to me. I don't care where my neighbors came from or who their ancestors were. What is important to me is whether or not they are good.

I don't judge people according to their skin color or ethnic heritage, but I do judge them by their deeds and attitudes, thus:

I approve of immigrants if they are respectful of our laws, productive, and grateful.

I tend to disapprove of immigrants who are disrespectful of our laws, parasitic, or ungrateful.

I cannot speak for Mitch but I wouldn't be surprised if he holds the same attitude.

Glad to hear it, eightgun, but why don't we let Angryclown verify. What's your zip code?

AC is in stalker mode.

OrnerySwine,

I'm surprised you think you are entitled to that information. You won't get it no matter how many times you ask.

Figured you were full of sh1t.

I'm guessing "pretty ethnically diverse" to you means an Italian-American family five blocks away.

AC, I mean that I see black Americans, Hispanics, Asians, Arabs, and Africans all around me every day. We (all them folks and us honkies too) shop at the same stores, eat at the same restaurants, bank at the same banks. We get along just fine, AC. Pretty typical of most of America.

Right, AC, someone declines to offer up zip code info to a chain yanking loon, so that obviously means he's full of shit. Nice and convenient way to "win" an argument, even though everyone here can't help but notice you didn't.

And the Clown's zip code is...?

Because as long as everyone on this blog is a pseudonym anyway, I guess I'll say I live in 10011, and trump all discussion!

Kermit revealed: "my brother-in-law's parents immigrated (legally) from China."

Brian Jones asked: "Quick show of hands: who's considering eating Chinese on Cinco de Mayo?"

Kermit's sister?
Posted by angryclown at March 30, 2006 10:58 AM

Actually she makes excellent eggrolls. She learned from me. I learned from some Russian friends. Here in the homogenous Midwest.

Yeah eightgun, you just don't live within miles of 'em. Or send your kids to the same schools. Or go to church with 'em. How do I know? Cause otherwise you wouldn't be so confident in the nonsense you're spouting.

Kerm, I don't think you got the joke.

It was a joke? Oh, right. My brother-in-law is Chinese. When I first met him I asked "Are you Chinese?" And he replied "No, I'm from Chicago."
See, maybe you're not getting it, AC. The first thing this wingnut looks at is not ethnic. It's what a person says that begins an impression.
This may be a foriegn concept (little joke there) to the liberal mind, which seeks to classify all people by some sort of potential victim status.

"Right, AC, someone declines to offer up zip code info to a chain yanking loon, so that obviously means he's full of shit. Nice and convenient way to "win" an argument, even though everyone here can't help but notice you didn't."

I suppose that's a good point. If I went to the Twin Cities and asked where the dumbest guy around lives, I could accidentally get you or Badda instead of eightgun. But if I'm able to narrow it down to a single zip code, I'd find him easy.

"If I went to the Twin Cities and asked where the dumbest guy around lives..."

...then a fair chunk of people would give you the office of Senator Mark Dayton.

Funny thing, but lawyers only have to compete for work with people who've passed a bar exam acceptable by their state courts. An illegal Mexican immigrant who tries to practice law will be caught, fined, and possibly imprisoned. You'd think lawyers would be anxious to allow the poorest and least skilled Americans the same protection they claim for themselves, but then sacrificing someone else's livilihood to achieve your moral ideals is always easier than sacrificing your own.

AC, if you're even remotely familiar with the "Plain Layne" story, you'd know that even a zip code can be an entirely too dangerous thing to share with the Internet.

I liked the story Mitch.

Well, believe it or not, since I live up here next to Mennonite country (a fact angryclown & other "non-bigots" on the left love to make fun of...puzzling how bigotry actually goes both ways...but I digress) I grew up literally surrounded on all sides by Hispanics-or Latinos-or Chicanos-it all depended on the decade what you were s'pose to call them. The town was probably closing in on 50% Hispanic. The main thing was we were all American kids from American families. We all played together and ate supper, stayed overnight,even went on each other's vacations, without giving it one single thought. BUT, there were also in our town, from time to time, illegals. The Hispanics in town did not approve of them any more than the Anglos. The Hispanic cops did not approve of them and they were arrested when found to be illegal. That was in the 60's & 70's in Leadville, Colorado (80461 case you want to check on that demographic AC). It is now over-run with illegal immigrants and the schools are failing. There is no tax base (the mine our dads worked at back then closed 20+ yrs ago)-a wonderful place to grow up is still unbelievably beautiful, but going to hell in a hand-basket.

Val, you and others who want to be part of the pot, welcome aboard. To those who expect something for nothing f**k Y*u! If we pulled the same crap in Mexico I don't think anybody would give a damn what we thought.

Sorry to disappoint you again, AC, but there are a lot of people of different ethnicities living within 1 mile of me, let alone 2-5 miles. I don't have kids, so there goes that little turd you threw at me. I attend a church that happens to be outside my neighborhood, but I go to that particular church because of the pastor there.

Why not just admit, AC, that you aren't willing to believe I'm not a bigot? It seems to me that there is nothing I can say to you to convince you that I am not. Your mind is closed on the issue, and I'm not interested in playing games with you.

I spout with confidence because I know what I am talking about. I ought to; it's what I see every day in my life.

Thanks!!! furniture Very nice site.I enjoy being here.