Toxic AF Romper Room

This is an open thread for all the random dick-measuring y’all wanna do. Like arguing about the Holocaust.

An even on which this blog has been crystal clear throughout its history, if you happened to read any of it.

Or branch out and flame away over whether Van Halen is “Metal” or “Hard Rock”. Knock yourselves out.

The conversation — one of the most comical threadjacks this blog has had since “Dog Gone” was fumigated – will not metastasize into any other threads. I need say no more.

342 thoughts on “Toxic AF Romper Room

  1. Mr Ball Milk,

    Y’know, you had it right, for just a bit there. I disagree with Tom – on this issue, strenuously. His online manners are (and for 25 years have been) as atrocious as he is a stand-up guy in person (reminds me of Paddy in that way). He’s also an old friend who is right on most issues…

    …and, even if that weren’t the case, I’m doing for him what I’ve done (to the chagrin of Justplainangry among others) to God only knows how many prog commenters; letting them say what they will, and let the combined brains of this comment section pummel and flense them. It led to me allowing “Dog Gone” and “Doug” to prattle away endlessly before they finally crossed a line even I couldn’t allow.

    Now, given that there are three progs in this comment section on a red-letter day, and the fact that Berg’s Sixteenth Law is iron-clad and universal, it usually ends up being the conservative commenters who do the actual policing (as, indeed, has happened on this subject, with quite a few of the regulars joining me in bringing the facts up with – hang on to your hat – not a single “ball-milking” reference).

    My principle, in this comment section as everywhere in the world, is “meet bad speech with good speech”.

    Too simple? We’ll see. It’s like looking for pearls in a bucket of ball milk.

    Anyway – you wrote:

    Mitch Berg: “Ya know, neo-nazi or nazi-sympathier or white supremacist is a little strong. I like to call him a “loose cannon”.”

    Yep. He’s an old friend, he’s right about most things (but not this one), and I keep my arguments to facts as much as possible.

    And let’s be honest – after your “bang Swiftee’s wife” and “Ball Milking” spiels, you appear to be an even looser cannon. One I don’t know. At all.

    And if my time in blogging has taught me anything, is that “Anonymous and unknown to me” plus “Full-bore creepy” equals “This never ends well”.

    The fact that, after two days, you keep trying to convince…yourself, and the short bus full of Emeries, apparently, that lack of purple-faced ire is assent (or, as you refer to it, “ball milking”) is…well, of concern.

  2. Doctor,

    (Switching into more good speech mode) We have no evidence “Kraephammer” is homosexual or has a taste for children.

    We do have evidence that he goes creepy really, really fast. Which, among progs, is not even “dog bites man”, more’s the pity.

    Ball Milking. FFS.

    Hope that settles all “loose cannon” japes.

  3. Mr. “Ball Milk” Kraephammer,

    I get it – Doc Strunk goes homophobic fast. It’s another trait I disagree with. Stop it, Doc.

    And in response, you went full-bore kraepy homophobic on…me?

    For the guy who walks around this comment section signaling his moral and intellectual virtue with an air horn, that seems…incongruous?

    Do explain.

  4. I hope I meet this Tom Swift guy some day….he sounds like my kind of people.

    As to Ball Milk Krap hammer, well, I have no proof of his penchant for young boys….just calling ball milkers and strikes outs as I see em.

  5. Mitch, I was mimicking Tom’s gay baiting vibe and mocking your deference to him, as I say, shitting in your comment threads for the last 15 years with gay baiting.

  6. If you are not a lunatic, just what are you, JK? Self-appointed censor of the internet? We already have one those, named Tim Cook:
    “We only have one message for those who seek to push hate, division and violence: You have no place on our platforms. You have no home here.”
    Apple CEO Tim Cook, Dec. 4, 2018

    Cook has a BS in engineering and an MBA from Duke. He is not qualified to judge what speech should be allowed on the internet. It is both shocking and frightening that the CEO of a private company believes he can and should control the speech of the American people.

  7. Me too Tom Swift, balls and strikes. You’re a shit bag racist with a “personality disorder” as Mitch would say.

  8. JK,

    All right. You’ve diagnosed “Dr. Strunk”. Mazes tov.

    MO ask you a question.

  9. And it may come as a shock to you, but not to some of the others who tell me they’d like me to keep a firmer hand on the comment section, but this is the first sustained bout of homophobic language I’ve seen from him in quite some time.

    Not sure what you were reading over the last 15 years. And given the amount of time I don’t force myself to spend moderating comments, it’s entirely possible.

    That being said, I think you’re overstating the “deference“.

  10. Say, Ball milker Krap hammer?

    You seem to know “Tom” as well as Mitch…kind of doubting he wouldn’t have knocked you TFO from what I hear, but whatever. Tell him to give me a holler, will ya?


  11. Also: just so I have this straight, you “mimicking“ objectionable speech is fair game, but my letting the free market of ideas counter objectionable speech in my comment section equals assent with holocaust denial?

    Am I missing something, here?

  12. Mitch, your protestations aside, Krap hammer knew what “ball milking” is….please tell me that’s not homo af.

  13. That, and “Krap hammer”

    In the words of the Paedophile in Chief “C’mon man!”

  14. MO, asks “If I’m not a lunatic, what am I?”  Decent question.

    I’m early 50’s, in the SW biz quite a bit like Berg as a gig guy, creature of the internet since the 90’s, long history political message boarding.  I’ve read this blog a long time, which is why I know it in and out.  Like to discuss and argue.  Kinda a rhetorical puritan and literalist.  Won’t let people off the hook for crap thinking, will belabor the point.  Temperamentally conservative.  Less politically conservative these days.  Still quite a bit away from being a prog.  Real disgusted with trashy Republicanism these days.

    Berg had an inclination to think I was the cartoonist from the freaky deaky local left years ago… I’m not.  I’m my own deal.  You’ll never encounter me aside from here.

  15. JK.

    While I wait for you to answer MO’s question….

    It occurs to me I’ve been doing this all wrong.

    You’ve stated as fact, repeatedly, that you are much, much smarter than your host and the rest of the commenters. Now, fact is, you’re still on store credit with that assertion, but let’s take you at your word, and run with the concept.

    Let me give you a scenario with a bit of an allegory:

    When asked which franchise I prefer, Star Wars or Star Trek, I answer “Firefly”.

    Now, if as I”m walking down the street I run into a guy who I know, from all my research on the subject to the fact that he’s wearing a “Mandelorian” costume, is a big “Star Wars” nerd. I’ve heard about the guy for years. But the fact is, I don’t really care about Star Wars, and haven’t since about one hour into “Plague of the Ewoks” or wetf it was called.

    And as I see him, he says “Clarence Clemons was a terrible saxophone player”. Something I know to be objectively wrong. And he follows up with “And John Wood of the US Fourth Armored DIvision was an incompetent leader”. Two assertions that any rational person knows to not only be the opposite of the truth, but just plain daft.

    Should I – remember, a Firefly fan – call him an ignorant Sand Person whose mother banged Jar Jar Binks – knowing full well that my quiver of derogatory sick Star Wars burns is now completely empty, and he has not yet begun to rain down the Lucas Universal hurt from a lifetime of having Star Wars-centered arguments?

    Or, being a Firefly person and above all that Disney dreck, should I pick a much better battle, let him roil in his impotent Yoda-isms and figure out how to fight a battle on my home turf?

    Since you are clearly the smartest person to habit this blog since Dog Gone left the building, you shouldn’t have much trouble figuring out what I was trying to say .

    Being a mere caveman, I’ve probably already forgotten.

  16. “Temperamentally conservative. Less politically conservative these days. Still quite a bit away from being a prog, but not adverse to milking a ball or two when the opportunity presents”

    FTFY Ball Milker

  17. See, that attempt to communicate intelligently with a bug is another thing he and I diverge on.

    But he’s a breddy good guy…still but him a beer.

  18. I guess Ball Milker is running your scenario by his “young adult”, Berg.

    He should be done in a couple more minutes.

  19. JK, I have no problem with you presenting your opinion on Strunk’s comments or taking on Strunk directly, it’s your belief that you have a right to order MBerg to remove Strunk’s comments or ban him outright that I find unhinged.
    I could go over to the Democrat Underground and order them to remove commenters that I feel have engage in hate speech, but I don’t because A) it’s none of my business what the DU puts on its website and B) I am not a lunatic, so I do not believe it is my job to police the speech of others.
    There are a few exceptions to the constitutional guarantee of free speech. What Strunk has written is not covered by one of those exceptions. Basically you don’t like Strunk’s comments and rather than simply not reading them, you want MBerg (who you say you have not met) to censor Strunk’s comments or ban him.
    That is crazy.

  20. ^ WOW— SiTD’s designated White Nationalist — Dr Mengele continues with his shitposting.

    It’s a shame you lacked a more positive role model in your formative years. Sad really….

  21. MO, I must push back gently.

    “Crazy” is generally accepted to be a state normally intelligent, well adjusted people become when they lose their mental facilities.

    Ball Miller Krap hammer is a reprobate leftist. His apparent intelligence

  22. MO, I must push back gently.

    “Crazy” is generally accepted to be a state normally intelligent, well adjusted people become when they lose their mental facilities.

    Ball Miller Krap hammer is a reprobate leftist. His propensity to lying, sexual deviance and incomprehensible responses are the manifestations of leftist indoctrination upon a person of low intelligence.

    He’s not crazy; just c*nt drunk and stupid.

  23. Potato Head ventured: “It’s a shame you lacked a more positive role model in your formative years.”

    I bet that’s what the cops say to Potato Head Jr. every time they raid a crack house.

  24. I might go get the J&J shot on top of the two Moderna jabs and then comment through it.

  25. That’s a good idea, Tater.

    Be like jumping out the window of rehab, joining Tater Jr. in smoking a few rocks, then going back to mock the councilors.

    Solid plan.

  26. Usually, when folks put in their docks and lifts at the lake home, they spend the rest of the day touring the lake on their 36′ Sea Ray, then have a nice meal at the club.

    Potato Head throws a few 55 gal barrels in to the ditch and then retires to the so how wide and enjoyes some Big Macs and Natties.

  27. jfc…I hate spellchecker

    Ball Miker Krap hammer is a reprobate leftist. His lack of intelligence is inherent.

  28. Red Stripe with a scoop of frozen margarita — delicious!

    Unfortunately, anti-mask, anti-vax behavior by a sizeable section of the public is what allows variants to adapt and spread, greatly prolonging the wait before we see something resembling pre-pandemic days.

  29. Emery,

    We’ve been through this before, haven’t we?

    If you look at death rates around the country, there is no correlation between mask mandates and death rates. New York and New Jersey our full blown mascist States, and have been charnel houses from the beginning. The rural west is largely unrestricted, and largely still unaffected.

    Wisconsin is considerably less restrictive than Minnesota, and has a 5% lower death rate.

  30. “Wisconsin is considerably less restrictive than Minnesota, and has a 5% lower death rate.”

    Blah blah blah….when’s the Y gonna open?

  31. When it comes to Emery, you must remember that he still believes in the Russian collusion hoax.
    There is simply no getting through to some people. It reminds me a little of the time that commenter Dog Gone claimed that nearly all lesbians were left hand handed & I had to talk through the point that “twice as likely to be left handed than non-lesbian” meant twice 2%, not 2:1 lefties over righties.

  32. I have no idea whether or not Kraephammer is an engineer. If he is, he should realize that he is being irrational. Going on the blog of a complete stranger and demanding that offending commenters be banned and their posts deleted puts you on the crazy train.

  33. MO, Krap hammer and Potato Head work for the same Engineering firm.

  34. DPS
    If kraephammer is any kind of engineer most likely he’s one of those repugnant CompSci dweebs whose answer to every problem is to take yet another stab at personally writing The Ideal Modular OS™ and thus saving all mankind from itself. In real life he’s a documented medical marvel: OCD/NPD with Tourette Syndrome, show a little sympathy.

  35. Gosh, although I am not a software engineer (although I filled in for a software engineer for a semesters back in the late 90s). I used to do field service on ADAC systems way back in the 80s. For the last half of my career I operated real time software & hardware in a research environment.
    Now I am retired, living on the vast sums I have accumulated by simply using common sense and avoiding (not evading) taxes on my retirement nest egg.
    I would love to see a thread dedicated to the flaws in the current approach to software engineering in scientific disciplines.
    Let me start: historically a choke point of software engineering has been scalability. Modularity and then team management were introduced to solve (at least partially) the scalability problem.
    The result has been that discrete problems (writing software to accomplish task x) have been replaced by indiscrete problems (team management of individual personalities).
    I’m not seeing the great leap forward, here.

  36. I can give an example of the issues that STILL plague software development for special-purpose projects.
    A data pipeline was needed, beginning with data from hardware sensors. The end point was the data, packaged in a commonly used format. The individual that was best suited to create this package had recently retired. He was given the opportunity to produce the package for a nominal fee. He agreed to do it as a bit of a lark.
    The result was 4,000 line c-shell script. Because the individual liked c-shell. It worked, flawlessly, but how the Hell do you maintain it?

  37. MO, 

    I’ve never once demanded a deletion of anything, just as I never “doxed” anyone.  The whole Swiftee riff, by me, is to merely marvel that Mitch as a guy doing seriously crafted public commentary work allows Tom Swift to shit in his comment threads like an insane person on a daily basis.  And there’s also the matter of the double standard, as I said earlier.

    I don’t expect Mitch to do anything.  At this point, I hope he never does. If you have an observation about the righty blogosphere being social misfits / island of misfit toyland, as I do, Tom Swift on SiTD is the example that proves it.

  38. JK, If you are not doxing, don’t refer to a commenter by another name than his/her nic.
    This should be obvious. Jeez.
    If you don’t want Strunk banned, then what the Hell do you want? Just state it clearly.
    Is it even possible to satisfy your needs?

  39. MO
    “how the Hell do you maintain it?”
    That is the Achilles heel of the tech world. Most current software isn’t written with the notion of long term viability. Its written almost exclusively by people <35 yrs old who have no intention of EVER doing maintenance on the code they've written, that's for some inexperienced newbie who has to do maintenance as part of his probationary period before he(yes he because shes are getting fewer in the field) goes on to write brilliant code of his own. Code is written to be discarded with the Next Total Rewrite that is always proposed for any subsequent version, because all these astonishingly brilliant CS engineers are too good to refine, refactor, and upgrade someone else's code. Hell its beneath them. Also in the case of your C-Shell wizard obfuscation and/or opacity will virtually guarantee him a sinecure if he wants it.
    The problem is twofold; middle and senior management fall in love with the big budgets that rewrites bring, and the self-aggrandizing "engineers" are oblivious to the goal of the enterprise (to provide goods and services to the customer).

    Maintenance Programming is an virtually untapped goldmine but fewer than 2 out of 100 CS Grads have any prep or inclination for it, they're like journalism grads; they all think they will change the world.

  40. I’m currently at a company – as a full time employee, as luck would have it – that’s had a small quiver of signqture products for almost 20 years, and a group of “lifers” who’ve been there most of the time to build and maintain it.

    The attitude toward producing code is sooooo much different than I’m used to encountering in the wild.

  41. Maintenance Programming is an virtually untapped goldmine

    I do have a friend from an earlier life who went specifically into that – to the point of becoming a COBOL guru. He’s not in his 60s or 70s – he got into it long after COBOL “died”.

    Maintaining other peoples’ code is apparently pretty lucrative.

  42. I don’t think COBOL pays any better than anything else.  I certainly don’t think it pays better than being a programmer with a great java skill set.  I had COBOL on my Dice and in my resume for many years, because I had used it in 2001-2004.  So I’d get calls on it.  The rates they were quoting for consulting (on w2) were like $65.  I ended up deleting it from my res.

    Re maintenance.  I suppose that’s literally right…. The notion of maintenance hasn’t even been in my headspace for say 10-12 years under Agile / CICD processes.  But that’s the point, the code is constantly being enhanced / improved.

  43. MNerg wrote: “We’ve been through this before, haven’t we?”

    Feel free to provide a link from Johns Hopkins, Mayo,Cleveland Clinic or JAMA that supports your theories regarding masks and vaccines.

  44. Not masks, Emery. “cloth face coverings.”
    This is why you need empirical data, not models, to judge their effects.
    And in any case, as your continued belief in the Russian collusion hoax demonstrates, you don’t give a damn what the evidence shows. You can’t reason a person out of a position he did not reason himself into.

    One problem with working with dated software is the linked libraries may need to be updated as well and you may only have compiled versions of those libraries, or be legally unable to modify them.
    Java has a huge existing code base, but Java is a language that is difficult to write properly (time intensive development) and java code has to be rewritten and recompiled relatively frequently, not just to take advantage of new features, but because people are always finding security bugs in older versions.
    I think java is on its way to becoming cobol. A half century from now, people will still be running critical applications written in java 8.

  45. Emery,

    And to think I say progressives can’t get through more than one round of debate without punting to logical fallacy – in this case, not just “Appeal to Authority”, but “Appeal to Non-Sequitur Authority”.

    Let’s try this again, Emery.

    Look at death rates around the country. Compare and contrast:

    • Mascist Minnesota versus unrestricted Wisconsin next door. Wisconsin is safer, well outside the margin of error, despite being not only without a mandate, but older, fatter, drunker and more densely populated.
    • Of course, there’s no correlation between mascism and being an abattoir: compare mascist New Jersey and California
    • Having no mandate? Not correlated either way; pro-choice South Dakota is high-ish (although most of the deaths were concentrated during a surge during a hard autumn, weather-wise), while equally free-choice Utah has a death rate about 1/3 the national average.

    I could go on, but honestly, why?

    So, Emery/ies, answer me two questions I’d appreciate you answering, but expect you to deflect away from:

    1. Thoughts on those numbers?
    2. Do you think Johns Hopkins, Mayo,Cleveland Clinic or JAMA would look at those comparisons and draw different conclusions than I? Explain your reasoning in terms that don’t rely cascading levels of logical fallacy.


  46. Mitch
    There were until just 2 years ago a couple people I knew making comfortable 6 figure salaries at HennCo maintaining their COBOL based Property Information System that was written originally in the 1970s.
    The reason to keep old COBOL systems alive is that they work and they’re already paid for!
    Watch what passes across the screens of tellers in a bank; yes there is slick new Windows based stuff but there are also imbedded CICS green screen apps from 40 years ago, again, paid for and works.

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